Scale Soaring UK

I wrote to the BMFA asking if they were going to represent us to the NT over this flying ban, still no reply after a few weeks.

I thought there was an agreement that we should belong to the BMFA in order to fly on NT land, if this has now been superseded by the NT ban on our ‘drones’ (Gliders) then we no longer need to belong to the BMFA and use membership of the LMA for insurance purposes? Why belong to two associations?

Failing any acknowledgment from the BMFA of which is correct this seems to be the way forward? For a national association to offer no advice or even acknowledge to a huge change in our position feels wrong.

Having lost access to a number of excellent flying sites close to me for no good reason, or am I wrong in my summing up? My local club says ‘carry on but the advice may change later’, I won’t until it’s sorted out at a national level.

M

Well said, it seams to me the BMFA are only interested in flat field flying
Perhaps the ssuk could offer an insurance?

I think you will find that the NT actually mean "Drones", or quadcopters as we would call them.



BC

What ban of flying on NT property?
Not heard anything about banning us from the Long Mynd.
It may be a locallised NT thing and as such the BMFA would not necessarily be aware of it.

Does not seem right that they have not replied to you.
I usually get something back within 24 hours of asking a question.
Try ringing Andy Symons in the office.

John M

The ban is on the NT website banning the flying of ‘drones’ over any NT site, no differentiation of what sort of drone you have. There is mention of flying over NT visitors and safety.

I’m surprised that this hasn’t got around the grapevine quicker?

John their website states "All aerial activity above our sites is prohibited unless specific permission is granted, according to an existing byelaw. "

Which is what I always thought the position was.

Down here in Cornwall we have been having along (18 month) discussion with the local NT ranger due to Peregrine falcons breeding at St Agnes Head - our main flying site. What is clear is that they think of quadcopters when they say 'drones' and they are not trying to ban model flyers.

Hi Frank, The document you comment from is the one that seems to be causing all the confusion down south at the moment, and this really needs sorting out quickly. That document not only mentions Drone's but actually states U.A.Vs. and as you say specify 'All Ariel activity' is prohibited on their land.
However I give a link to the B.M.F.A document written after the N.T. document stating that none powered model aircraft are welcome on their land.This I believe to be the savior document which at the moment we all fly by.
However (again) Here in the South a number of N.T. sites have been shown that allowing sustainers make slope flying much safer for all. The possible uncontrollable loss of lift can catch pilots out. (who hasn't landed out in their flying career and picked up the re kitted pieces). This coupled with the size and weight of modern model aircraft could create a safety issue unless managed by a means to overcome the fickle wind. The N.T. has agreed and we have enjoyed the use of sustainers here for some time.
However,(yet again) new N.T. rangers wanting to make a name for themselves and not liking the name we have chosen for them revisit the old document that Frank is commenting on. When challenged they replie that after the governments white paper and further discussions have taken place between the BMFA and the N.T. All will become clear and they will have better information from above. Meanwhile because it is determend that a pilot should never overfly people and that most slopes have people roaming about, neither the pilot nor the N.T. can be certain that to fly would be safe. Therefore the C.A.A and B.M.F.A. confirm that under these circumstances a pilot should not fly. End of story as far as they are concerned.This of coarse is no different than we have had before BUT, the news of drones in the media has brought it to the fore. Our concern is that this attitude will spread within the rangers before a definitive decision has been made from above. We as a body of flyers down here have decided to carry on as we were until that decision has been made. Terry.

BMFA Members and Model Flying on National Trust sites.

Thanks Terry. Before people rush to put pen to paper (or finger to keyboard), it's worth remembering that clumsy requests for clarification can easily get you an answer you don't want. A recent example concerns the relaxation negotiated by the BMFA that Operator IDs could be inside the model provided no special tools were needed to get to it. Some clever soul sought clarification of what constituted a 'special tool' so it was duly clarified to 'no tool needed'.

I think the lesson is that a well intentioned concession or permission should generally be welcomed, even if it is a bit ambiguous. Gift horses, and all that.

I tend to agree with this. Best to keep quiet and keep flying. Everyone is in total panic at present.

Let things settle down, and see what happens.



BC

Here's details of the "ban" at Minchinhampton near Gloucester from the South Cotswold Soaring Association http://scsa.org.uk/minch.htm

looks like gliders with sustainers shouldn't be a problem, but it may have to be discussed site by site.

The BMFA have decided to reply to my query, at last, they talk about the slow pace (!) of the National Trust in making changes and for the moment the use of un-powered gliders by BMFA members is ok on NT land. There are more talks on the subject in the New Year.